Ep. 210 - Gretchen Hertler: The Kindness That Endures

0:01 Stories from Real Life is a production of Media Well Done, LLC. In this episode of Stories from Real Life, Melvin E. Edwards sits down with retired kindergarten teacher, author, advocate, and nonprofit founder Gretchen Hurtler. Over a lifetime of service, Gretchen has impacted countless lives through education, community outreach, and her nonprofit organization, Keep a Baby Warm. She discusses the lessons she learned from decades in the classroom, how personal adversity shaped her outlook, and why compassion remains at the center of everything she does. This is Stories from Real Life, and today's story is Gretchen Hurtler's The Kindness That Endures You are listening to Stories from Real Life, a podcast by engaging storytellers for engaged story listeners.

0:53 Here's your host, author and journalist, Melvin E. Edwards. Hello again and welcome to another episode of Stories from Real Life. I'm your host, Melvin E. Edwards. Thank you for joining us for the podcast where real stories are so much more interesting than fiction. Today on Stories from Real Life, my guest is Gretchen Hurtler, a retired Connecticut kindergarten teacher whose life has been anything but ordinary. Over the years, she's worn many hats. Educator, advocate, traveler, author, charity founder, public relations professional, and survivor.

1:41 I met Gretchen in front of Buckingham Palace in England a couple of weeks ago and thought she was local from Liverpool. You can imagine how surprised that was when I realized she was in my travel group and on my bus. So Gretchen joins us today from her home state of Connecticut, not Liverpool or Dublin. Gretchen, welcome to the show. Thank you. It's nice to be here. Nice to have you as a guest. So you've traveled extensively throughout your life. What destination has had the greatest impact on you and why? It's got to be Ireland. You know, the people there are just lovely. Like you can't find a nicer group of people that are just willing to help you.

2:24 Just they're kind. They're happy. I don't know. There's just I can't find anything wrong with it. You know, they're just lovely. Could it be because you sound like them? I don't know. I don't think, you know, my family is from Ireland, but like, but from Germany, too. But like, I don't know, like, they really like, I think they go out to their way. I've never seen a group of people go out to their way to just be kind to a person, you know, and they look at life, I think, a little bit differently. I think that's what I like most. Yeah. So Ireland would definitely be my place. Based on that, is there a travel experience that completely changed the way you view people, culture, or the world?

3:08 That's a great question. I'm not sure if I could say that there is. With our tour that we just went on over through Europe, we've got to see so many countries and people and how they look at us and how we've always thought of them. So in a sense, that's life changing because I think it reminded me that, you know, really we have to look at everyone individually, you know, and not as the stereotypical group that we thought they were. Even people we've traveled with were just like, you know, I've never met from some places and you just have these ideas of what they would be like. So I guess that's the life changing itself is just to be able to meet a broad group of people and just take all those stereotypes away and be like, well, they're just amazing people to have met, you know, and then they come from this place and that's different, you know?

3:59 Yeah. That's why I would look at it, I think. Okay. So if you could recommend one place every person should visit at least once in their lifetime, what would that place be? Ireland. it has to be Ireland you know the rolling hills the kindness the you know the just non-judgmental it seems like they just know how to do it right they don't there's there's a judge-free zone when I one of my visits there the Boston Marathon incident happened and we were on our way home and I was in a store didn't know the woman at all and she's like, you know, you're Irish family from Connecticut.

4:40 She goes, you can't go back there. Your country's in dire straits right now. You're welcome to stay with my family until it settles down. And she doesn't know me. She didn't know me or my girls. So to just extend herself, her home like that, you just think that's the way we should be. That's the way we should all be, you know? So I would say, go to Ireland. They do it right there. Yeah, that would be it. Yeah, Ireland's actually the number one place I'd like to see. You have to. You have to. So let's talk about your time as a kindergarten teacher. What first inspired you to become a kindergarten teacher and what kept you in the profession for so many years?

5:22 Right. So I taught special ed for 18 years and then the bureaucracy got me out of it. It was too much paperwork. I loved working with the children with special needs. But I was bogged down in meetings and paperwork constantly. And it was just getting worse instead of better. Like the meetings were coming more often, testing. And I was having less time with the children. And I'm like, this is not what I signed up for. I'm not a paperwork person. So then I had the opportunity to, I had a dual teaching. So I said, I'm going to use my regular ed. and there were some openings and kindergarten was one of the openings and I was like okay this sounds like fun you know and I was up in junior high special ed which was really working with socially emotionally maladjusted kids and so that was quite a change then to go down to kindergarten where they're just like an open book and yeah it was it was the perfect it was the perfect switch for me I think um And also, I always tried to go opposite of where my children were.

6:22 So as my girls got older, I moved down lower so that I wouldn't wear out my patients. Because if you've got the same at home as in school, you can wear out your patients' level with that. So I tried to do it at different levels. Yeah. Does that make sense? I don't know. It made sense to me when I was in it. All right. So, yes. Yeah. Yeah. All right, kindergarten is often a child's first experience with formal education. What do you hope every student, what did you hope every student would take away from your classroom? To love learning, to just wonder what's on that next page in a book, to wonder what's going to happen tomorrow and to be ready for it, to be excited about it.

7:04 And I think that's what kindergarten should do. It should make you excited about learning, about what's happening in the world and be open to everybody in it you know not and I find that kindergartners are like that you know they don't see color they don't see anything they just see they're very self-absorbed but but they also just see people for what they are you know like sadly they they if you have a blemish on you they will point it out like they have no filters you know and living a life without filters that's kind of can be fun it's it's but it's not for the pain of heart you have to be sick kids you cannot take it personally you're just like yep that's a blemish yep thanks for yep you know and it is what it is you know what I mean and you have to go in knowing that whatever fault you have it will probably be brought out yep and be alright with that and be and just like go with the flow with it because isn't that Isn't that wonderful?

8:12 Instead of somebody talking behind your back, they're not going to talk behind your back. They'll talk it right to your face. Yeah. I like it. So when I first met you, you told me some of those great stories from your classroom days. Can you share a couple of those stories now? Sure. Let me think of a couple. Oh, I know one you probably did like. So I had this little girl that she came in every day prim and proper. Like she came in just beautiful. Her mom dressed her perfectly every day from her head to her toe you know and it's just how I expected to see her every day you know and me you know like I'm not a great dresser like I mean I come in together you know but there was a second grade teacher I had to walk down the hall and she was just like this little girl she came in her shoes matched her outfit like she just came in every day looking like a 10 you know and she'd come out of her room and she'd look at me and she would maybe straighten out my car and she'd say, your shirt's inside out.

9:15 And I'd be like, I'll fix that. And she's like, okay. And she just like would give me a once over. And so, you know, go down to my room, flip over my shirt or whatever. I don't know how that happened. And so anyway, going back to this little girl, she was just like that teacher. She did perfect. And one day she came in and she was just not perfect. She was just like, A little free-spirited looking, you know, to me. Things match, but it was just like her hair was a little must. But she came in with the biggest smile on her face, and she looked happy. And I said, hey. And I didn't know. I thought, well, maybe... they had a rough morning or mom and dad like maybe argue something you never know what's happening so I just kind of like touched her hair and I said you're good this morning and she goes yeah you know why and I said why and she goes I told mom I wanted to look just like you today and I noticed that okay wow like that was a compliment to her even though she was a bitch of a mess I'm like really and I looked over at my other kindergarten teacher and she just smiled and she goes I'm going to pee my pants and I'm like okay I said well we are definitely twinsies today and she's like yeah and happy as could be like she's happy and I was like that kind of was like a look at myself as like well you know she wanted to be like me that's a compliment but maybe I just I kind of need to get myself together

10:46 a little bit more I don't know But it was fun, you know? And like, okay, yeah. You know, there's so many stories with these little ones. They just, they're full of stories, you know? They had two little boys walking down the sidewalk, you know, coming into the classroom from recess time. And one walked right out of his shoe. And the next one walked right in his shoe. And they kept walking. And I said, stop. And they looked at me a little befuddled, like, why? And I said, I need you to look down. And they looked down and one boy goes, I'm missing a shoe.

11:28 And the other boy goes, I got two shoes. I can give you one. I said, that is a shoe. And he's like, and the boy looks at me and goes, yeah, thanks. And he gives him the shoe and I'm like, did you not see that you didn't have a shoe on? He goes, no. and I said, did you not feel two shoes? Nope. I'm like, all right. And they were just happy, switched the shoes and they just looked at me like, and it's like, that's life. You know, it's like, sometimes you wear two shoes, you know, and you just, and you move on, you know, and I was like, maybe it's me. Two shoes and one foot, that is. Yeah, and you know, and he kept walking, and the other one just kept walking, and I thought, well, no, you can't, but I love that.

12:15 That sounds like what you'd see on a cartoon. Right, but that is kindergarten. Kindergarten's like, their body self-awareness is just not there. Like, you can walk down the hall and stop. and they will run into the person in front of them every single time. Now you can do this three times in a way to go to art and to go to another area. And as soon as you stop, it will happen again. It's just like a little comic relief happening and you just look and you go, but should we be ready to stop at any point? And they're like, yes. And I'm like, but you don't, you know, like you're always bumping into them, you know?

12:57 And it's just, it's who they are, you know, and it's fun and it's happy. And I think nowadays you have to teach them to get in the mud, to get dirty. Like they're so used to like being in the house. It's not used to when I grew up, like you'd go out and play outside and you get dirty and you know, you're going to have a bath and you bring them outside and you say, you know, well, that's just, we're going to talk about mud today. And they're like, oh, I can't get dirty. Why not? Well, my mom doesn't want me to get dirty. Well, we're going to wash off when we go inside. And I want them to get their hands in the mud. And they're not used to doing that anymore. And that's sad. It's sad that that's the way it's been now, you know? So there's a turn I would like to see education take where we get a little bit dirty, you know?

13:44 But that's just a couple of stories with them. Okay. So is there a particular student or classroom moment that reaffirmed why you chose teaching as your life's work? Yes, I had a boy, his name was John, and John was quite a handful, like he was just a lot. He was a lot for the kids, he was a lot for people, but he had a great heart. He just didn't know how to friend people, he didn't know how to see the room or see people, you know, he just couldn't get that. And it took all year for him to really learn how to be a friend or to have a friend. But even as he got another grace, that continued. So what happened was they'd always send John back to me.

14:25 Just go back to me. Because it would be too much and he didn't know how to handle the situation. So when he was frustrated, he goes, can't I just go back to her? Like, I don't know what to do. And so when he'd come to me, I'd say, what happened? And he goes, well, he would tell me the situation. I said, and how did you handle it? and he's like and we talk about it and he goes can I just stay here for a minute and I'd be like yeah breathe regroup go help the little ones I said then you need to go back but you've got to do it and be like okay this happened all the way through fifth grade every teacher would send him back you know because he would ask and it was like all right you know and then he left and I didn't hear a thing about him Until I got a letter from him and his mom, and he had joined the Marines, and he was a sharpshooter for the Marine Corps, and he got to go to a cotillion, and he got to take the person that influenced him most in his life, and he wanted to take me.

15:26 And he brought flowers to school, and him and his mom came, and they came with this poster board of pictures of him from kindergarten on up. and he talked to my kindergartners and he said just told him how I never gave up even on the hardest days and when he was the saddest and I thought that does it doesn't it you know like he knew that somebody was in his corner so yeah that was like the best moment you know yeah I get to have that story which is awesome that's pretty amazing yeah yeah that touches my heart you know So that's my, that's John. All right, take us back to the moment that inspired Keep a Baby Warm.

16:12 I had my first daughter and was in the hospital and she, I was next to a woman and I heard her ask the nurse, like, do you have anything for me to take my baby home in? And the lady and the nurse was like, oh, look for something, you know, don't worry. and I looked over and I said, are you okay? And she goes, yeah, you know, we just, things are hard. And I said, well, I had a baby shower. I said, I can give you something, you know, because she had a little girl too. And she goes, really? And I said, yes. And so I told my husband, bring something in. And I had thought about it and I remembered her face and I thought, oh my God bless her. You know, like she wanted to do the best and she just didn't have anything new or warm for her baby.

16:56 And this was in late September. So from then on, Every year I always said, okay, we can't do a lot, but whatever we can do, what we're going to do is whenever you have a party or something, instead of a gift, like maybe the kids can bring some clothes for a newborn baby. And my girls were good with that for like a Halloween party or something like that. And so it started that way. And then we decided on the day of love, which is Valentine's Day. that that's the day we bring them in so we would it started off with just a few packages you know a four or five and inside we have a blanket and a receiving blanket and outfit and socks and pacifier a clothes anything everything a baby would need to go home be warm in a hat you know and then I found this lovely woman who said I make blankets and I can make blankets for you.

17:51 And I'm like, you could. And she goes in hats that match. And I'm like, that's wonderful. And so it grew. And so then as I got to be a teacher, when I got to kindergarten, they got involved and the kindergartners would go and every kindergartner would have a package to offer and the parents would help me collect and they would make offerings in and we did that so now that I'm out of school some of my kindergarten parents still help like I put it on Facebook I say Valentine's coming they go we got you what do you need and so this is my 40th year of doing it everything goes 100% to the to the babies and I wrote a book And the book, 100% of the proceeds go to the babies charity.

18:35 So everything, whatever people want, it has to be new. If anyone ever wants to donate, it's keep a baby warm. They can contact me for anything, but it has to be new because of the hospital regulations. You know what I mean? That's why I can't use used items. But the nurses are like the angels that just give them out all year. And they give them to families that just like that woman that needed it didn't have anything new or warm for her for her baby you know so that's that's where we're at all right so what has kept you committed to the mission for so long for the keep a baby warm babies I just I love them I just do I always have and you know I was lucky to have three healthy ones you know what you mean and there just always is a need so like everyone looks for something that they can maybe do to help you know and when I see that that this is what we can do.

19:29 And I just, it's where I can make a difference. Somewhere I can really make a difference and really, you know, take care of something that has no, you know, they come into this world, they don't, they're doing the best they can do. You know what you mean? And I can help. That's great. So... I'll never stop helping them I've even like tried to get my girls to even say like after I'm dead like will you please keep doing it and they're like mom and I'm like no please just take care of the babies yeah I just always work what have you learned about compassion community and the power of small acts of service that all of it makes a difference no matter how small you think it is or who is going to get like benefit from it like Even if you get one person to benefit, isn't that enough?

20:19 Like, isn't that a difference? You know what I mean? And in this world, that's all we want to do. And in a positive way, I think. And at least that's my goal. You know, sometimes I just think, you know, I haven't done enough. And I just try to look for ways, you know. And this one just is so satisfying for me. And for people to get behind it, as much as they have, like, friends and teachers. I have a friend that she donates a book every year and she donates outfits. Her generosity helps so much with the charity. There's so many other people, they haven't given up on it. I think if they're willing, I'm going to keep going too.

21:02 I have this woman who still makes my blankets and hats. She's in her 80s now and she just loves it. It's her thing and she's just so happy to do it. you know so that's her name's Roberta by the way and she's just lovely yeah and she just keeps doing it and I my heart like if he can keep doing it at 80 keep making and then I could keep putting all these packages together and and do what I need to do to take care of the babies too you know so does that answer it I hope I do so imagine Imagine one of the newborns from your earlier deliveries is listening today as an adult.

21:46 What would you want that adult now to know? That you're loved. You may meet people that are mean-spirited or not very kind, but keep looking because there's a lot of people out there that are lovely people and will show you love and just believe in yourself and Keep putting acts of kindness out because it comes back to you tenfold. It really does. Like, I feel so blessed in my life. I know people would look at my life and not think it's a very blessed life. But to me, it is. To me, I'm still here to talk about it. And I'm still here to know that, you know, there are such good people out there, you know, that have been on my path.

22:26 So I've had a really blessed life, you know, and I think that's you keep putting good forward and it's just bound to happen. And so they need to do that. Just just know that it was given to them and they need to pass it forward. You mentioned having three children and you were married. Unfortunately, that marriage didn't end well. So taking a sort of a dark turn in our conversation. What were some of the earliest signs that your marriage was becoming unhealthy or abusive? Well, the physical abuse that was happening, you know, like I could see his mental, he was a police officer, and I could just see like his mental health digressing, his attitude getting angrier at the slightest of things going wrong.

23:13 And I was like, always the fault of all of it. You know, luckily, he approached He just... He was angry at the world. He was, you know, and I think when I talked to his family afterwards, I found out that he had issues long before I met him that nobody told me about, that he didn't tell me about. And I just, they were never addressed. And I think if they were, things would have been a little bit differently. You know, he was from the South, which he also like really loved and thought that if that was the salvation of everything, if we had just moved South, then that would fix all his problems.

23:57 and it didn't because he ended up moving down south and passing away there and it didn't fix it made it worse so if it could get worse but yeah but so basically his mental health digressing and then him becoming physically aggressive with me and the threats were just you know people Melvin E. Edwards And I was waiting for the right time, the right moment to leave.

24:52 And if you know someone in that situation, just be supportive to them. Just be there for them. Don't judge them. Don't do anything except for be a support. Don't wonder why they push you away sometimes or come back to you. They're doing what they need to do to survive. That's what they need. Yeah. How did that experience affect your confidence, identity, and your sense of self? It crushed it. And now I'm much better. But there was a time where, you know, like I'm not an aggressive, like physically aggressive person. And I had to learn how to protect myself. I had to learn how to move in my house at night.

25:36 I taught myself to move just in case he came back at where. He wouldn't know where I was. And that I could have an upper hand, you know, without being physically aggressive back to him. I had a friend that was in the service that he tried to teach me some self-defense things. And it just wasn't me. You know, it just wasn't me. So like for a time period, it broke. It broke. it broke me but I couldn't let it like there was no time to just pull up the sheets and say okay I'm done you know because I had three girls I have three girls depending on me you know who are young and you know I painted myself out of it I painted anything that was still I painted my porch I painted anything I painted my walls I painted anything just because with that paint I had a little bit of control I had control over what color that was in a time when I had no control, it seemed like.

26:35 And people would thought, what are you doing painting your porch right now while all this is happening? Well, because I had control over that porch. So that's a hard one to understand for people. But now that I've come on the other side of it, I think, yeah, it made me stronger. And to tell you the truth, to have those three girls, I would do it all again. I would put myself in that position All again, because they are my world. They are the best thing that ever, ever happened to me. So, yeah, you know, maybe I'm there for a reason. Maybe this all happened for a reason. And I'm really a person of faith.

27:16 I don't, I'm no longer think of myself as a Catholic, an Irish Catholic, which was the way I grew up. But I do consider myself a person of faith. And I have a great relationship with God. And he and I have had lots of chats about maybe he hasn't been paying attention to the limits that sometimes people have but then again you press against what's going on in the world and you say yeah he probably does have a handle on it and just have to suck it up a little bit you know but it's hard when you're going through it to see that but you lean on your face you lean on all of that you know and that's what you do And during this you wrote a book called Between the Darkness and the Light.

28:00 So tell us about a message you want readers to take away from your book. So I wrote this book talking to you like you're a friend of mine because I didn't want to have these large words or medical understanding of different situations, you know, because You may not have the same situation as me. Maybe you're just going through a divorce or maybe you're just going through a person in your life that has mental health issues. And there's everything out there to help a lot of these people, but there's not a lot out there to help people whose lives they've devastated. And that's why I really actually wrote the book because I was looking for help and couldn't find it anywhere, you know. And yet he was in and out of mental health facilities and getting all the help he could get.

28:42 And in the meantime, I lost my house. I Lost everything. And I'm like, who's going to help me? You know what I mean? And you just are like, what am I going to do? I had great friends. I had a sister that believed in me. And I had that kind of support. But I just had to let my girls know that life gets hard. Someone's not always there. You look around, and when we do this, you know, I always used to say to them, look around. Do you see someone to help us? And they're like, no. And I said, well, then we better figure it out, you know?

29:24 And life is like that. Sometimes you just have to figure it out, and it's not pretty, and it's messy. And this book says, hold on. Hold on to your faith. Hold on to something, even if it's not faith that you have. Hold on to something. And there's quotes in there that I thought would kind of help that start each chapter. And there's things like that that just let the person know that you're not alone. Even if it's not the same path as somebody else, it's going to be okay. You've made it through that day and you'll make it through the next one. You know, that's what the book is about, to letting them know they're not alone. All right. What are some of the responses from readers that have meant the most to you? Hmm.

30:04 People would say to me you know that's not my story but this part was and I'm like okay and they go and it's so good to identify with that it's so good to identify with someone else that was going through that and someone some people like we did I did book talks and they would just be like one woman's like I never knew anybody could survive that or just or live a life like that and be okay How are you okay? And I'm like, I'm right here in front of you. You know what you mean? Like, I'm okay because I choose to be okay. You know, there's choices. We can, we always have choices. You can have the worst, I've seen people have the worst situation growing up little children and you watch them and they come out of a home that is just like Horrible.

30:50 And yet they choose to be happy and they choose to look at life differently and not look at excuses. And then you find the people that do and say, well, I just come from a bad house and I'm going to be this. And, you know, so isn't it all perspective and a lens that you have on things? And my biggest thing has always been for my girls to learn and to say, you know, don't give up. Like you just have to be the best, you know, and take the best out of that experience and move on. Now the crazy thing is and I don't know if you know this at the same time that all this was happening with my husband and we're going through this divorce and it's ugly and he's hired someone to kill me like it's just like it's gotten really bad right and you think well it can't get any worse than this don't ever say that out loud because it can because you know what happened at that time my house decided my house decided to have spirits come in it now I'm not a big person I'm believing in the supernatural or spirits you know it's not something I've really came across and be like well I'm a believer I'm not a believer just wasn't a thing right but then I see blood coming down my walls I see music coming on I everything's happening in my house like that are unexplainable and you think okay I'm a smart woman yeah I bought an electrician what's happening is my like some wires crossed my house something's happening because my microwave's coming on the music's coming on this and that and

32:22 the electrician's going through he's checking everything out and he says yeah he's I remember this he's standing in my kitchen doorway and he's like there's nothing physically wrong with any of the wiring in your house and I'm like really and the minute he says that the microwave is next to him and it pops on and he looks at it and we hear a door close upstairs it just slams shut and he goes isn't it just you and me here and I said it is and he goes there's no charge for this he goes you're not getting a bill but I'm leaving and I said I hear you and he goes and I would recommend you leave and I said that's not an option for me right now because like I can barely hang on to this house right and so and he left.

33:13 And I remember calling my sister saying, I don't know what to do. Like, I don't know what to do. And so I brought priests. I got clergymen in. I thought, this is it. I'm going to bring a priest. I'm going to bring a Baptist minister. I brought everybody into my house. And I said, just do your thing because something's happening here and blood should not be coming down. You know, beds should not be rising. This should not be happening. and so they came in and they looked in my daughter's room and they said you know she had like rock and roll posters and they said oh that's probably it and I said that's probably it the rock and roll but I think a lot of kids like these rock and roll groups and it wasn't even like bad rock and roll groups and you know the Grateful Dead no oh yeah that's got to be help that that's got to be a problem I'm like you know like take down the poster I don't know so we're doing that and while they were there my daughter was sitting on her bed and all of a sudden there was an indent right next to her on the bed and she goes hey mom can you come here and I'm like what and she goes somebody's sitting next to me and I'm like and I could see the clergyman like they're all kind of looking and they're looking at me and I'm like I don't know what to and they weren't moving.

34:32 So I walked over to her and I said, if you're on this bed, get up. If not, I'm just going to sit on you because this is my daughter. And I just sat down and I had gotten the coldest chill and I'm like, I'm going to stay here. I'm just going to stay here anyway. And I did and I just held her hand and they said, we wish you the best and we hope that this all worked. And I'm like, do you think it worked? Did you see the bed? and they're like, this is the best we can all do, but we really want, you know, to know we're here for you. And they left. And I was like, this is not happening, you know, in which her music starts to play in her room.

35:13 And I'm like, okay, all right. So I talked to my sister and she goes, there's a lady and a man who do these kind of things. They get rid of things in the house. I'm like, the Warrens they're called the Warrens and they've been all over Europe they have been in the states they big name in like I guess different houses you know and I didn't know anything about them and they lived in Monroe Connecticut my sister got the number and I remember calling Lorraine Warren and her saying to me all right I hear you and she goes says I want you to try something and I said okay what what's that and she goes she says Tell your house that I'm coming and I'm going to do a cleansing.

36:00 I said, just tell my house that. And she goes, tell your house that. And she goes, and give it a few days and call me and tell me what happened. She goes, if there's something that you really need to call sooner, you know you're welcome to. I'm like, okay. So I proclaimed to my house that she was coming, blah, blah, blah. And I told my girls, I'm not going to lie. My house just quieted right down. Nothing happened. I was like, this is perfect. this is great so a few days passed everything was quiet I was like okay so I called her back I said you don't have to come my house is great and she goes oh honey I want you to tell your house that I'm no longer coming I said okay and she goes just call me back when you need to I said okay and I said girls I first talked to my girls and I said the house we don't have to have anyone come our magical house is now and that's what I called told my girls always it's just a magical house I said our magical house has decided to be quiet now which is lovely I said so we she doesn't have to come no longer do the words come out in my mouth where drawers started opening and shutting upstairs doors were slamming and I just called her right back and I said did it take five minutes and she goes just about and she goes okay I'm coming and she had come and she had told me to take everything living out of my house she stayed overnight but she had so she knew right away she came in and she's like where's your husband and I said he's in a mental health facility right now and she goes what did you put

37:34 in the backyard and I said in the backyard nothing and she goes oh there's things in your backyard darling and I said well he had a business called post-mortem cleanup where he would clean up after death scenes but I had set up a thing where they would all the stuff would be taken away legally in the right way and but I guess he decided not to use the Melvin E. Edwards It's supposed to cost a lot of money.

38:26 And I had left all my money from my income tax on the table. And when I came home, all the money was still there. And I said, you forgot to take the money. And she goes, oh, no, honey, I would never take it for something like that. She goes, it's just to keep all the people that just want notoriety and things like that away. She goes, but for people that really have a problem, she goes, I'm not taking your money. And she didn't. and she cleansed my house up and down stayed overnight and it was good until I had to leave the house till we sold it and she told me at that point things would change and pipes broke things happened but I did tell the new owners I told them I didn't want anything to be a secret I said you know I've had issues with this and I want you to know and they're like oh we love that kind of stuff we're good and I'm like Melvin E. Edwards Is that why your daughter started the ghost tours?

39:50 So, you know what? That was her first experience with it, right? And Lorraine knew right away that Courtney had a gift of doing things. And she said you and her... pointing to me and her that we both had, you know, quite a gift. And she's like, just be aware of it and stuff like that. So Courtney did get interested in that that way. But then she also had a love for history. So she took the two together and meshed it. And now her tour is really about history and spiritualism and how there is that vibration that's left behind of things that have happened with events that have happened in this world and how it does leave a vibration and spirit.

40:35 Yeah. So I think that is where it started. But it's not where she first... She went into... And with her company, you were in charge of... I'm sorry, what? With her company, you were in charge of public relations and security. With her company. That seemed like a strange combination. Did you ever have to rough up any... Yeah, any unruly ghosts being charged? No, it wasn't the ghosts that were unruly. It's the people. Like, you know, they come drunk or there's like drunk people that try to enter the tour. And you're just like, stop it, you know? And like this one drunk, he came up to me and there were these bands, like, you know, these colorful bands like that light up. And because you have 50 people on the tour or something just to keep them separated.

41:16 And he's like, hey, you know, What's happening with that band? And I said, they're talking to me. And he goes, they're talking to you? I said, yeah, they're talking about you. They said, you better leave now. And he goes, and he'd run away. You know, it's these crazy people, you know? And you just have to be as crazy as them. And you're just like, you know? I'm not going to be, I'm not going to be small, you know. And, you know, it's just, it's those people. And you just have to be like, is this what you want to do? Is this where you're going to make your stand, like making a joke and going, you know, and you're just like, you're like 65 years old.

41:57 Like, what are you doing? You know, I just like, it's those people that, yeah. You know, when, when, when the guy's introduced and they say, and this is Gretchen she's our security and they kind of look at me and laugh because they're like really you know and I'm like you know I carry Shillelagh don't worry about it you know and they're like okay you know so yeah and I yeah I just like so that's my security part that's interesting Gretchen you got you got some great stories and that's a great one to end it on today so my guest has been Gretchen Hurtler Gretchen Whether she was teaching kindergarten students, helping families to keep a baby warm, supporting others through her writing, or rebuilding her own life after difficult circumstances, she continuously found ways to transform challenges into opportunities to help someone else.

42:51 And we're thankful for that. So Gretchen, thank you for being here today. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you for having me and thinking I'm worthy enough to talk to you, you know? Thank you. I'm sure we'll get lots of people who think you're worthy enough to listen to. So when this episode comes out, I'm sure people will gain a lot from your wisdom. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Again, thank you for being here. Okay. Bye-bye. All right. So that's it for this week's episode of Stories from Real Life. Until next time, don't forget to shine your light wherever you go.

43:31 That was Stories from Real Life. Join us again next week for another great storytelling journey. See you next time. Stories from Real Life is a production of Media Well Done, LLC.